Llewellin Setter Registration When the first Llewellin Setters were imported to the US, they were so superior over all other pointing breeds, including all previous English Setter lines, that many unethical English Setter breeders started to call their Setters "Llewellins" in order to capitalize on the name, even if their Setters had nothing to do with Mr. Llewellin's breeding. In fact many started calling all field Setters or hunting Setters "Llewellin Setters" regardless of their bloodlines. It became so corrupted, that in 1902, Field Dog Stud Book 'FDSB' felt it was necessary to register those of pure Llewellin blood as "Llewellin Setters" recognizing them as a separate breed from the English Setter breed. They recognizes all Setters the only traced back to Duke - Rhoebe - Laverack crosses, but these included many dogs that Llewellin never had a thing to do with as long as they were of the Duke - Rhoebe - Laverack bloodlines, disregarding the selection of different indivigual dogs that were used.
Unfortunately, over the years the Llewellin Setter recognition as a separate breed was slowly changed in FDSB and they are no longer recognized as a separate breed today, but are now only given the distinction of being a line of English Setter and not a recognized breed of it's own. FDSB has them listed within the English Setter breed and no longer gives them the full recognition they deserve. It is mine and other top Llewellin Setter owner's and breeder's opinion's that because of this loose definition, FDSB has encouraged Llewellin Setter's continued out-crossing with English Setters with the intention of destroying the Llewellin's gene pool until their is not enough pure Llewellin Setters left to continue to recognize them any longer.
In fact, it's my opinion that their policy had nearly resulted in the extinction of pure Llewellin Setter's. In fact many imported Setters were approved by FDSB to be registered as "Llewellin Setters" for many years and generations, only for the "sole owner" of FDSB without any form of appeal, had changed his mind and change the dogs and their offspring's registrations to English Setters. This was done after many years of great sacrifices, large investments of money, and many breedings with other Llewellin Setters and years of advertising them had already taken place.
Only by the grace of God and the dedication of a few great Llewellin breeder's like our good friends Al and Drenda King of King Llewellin Kennel, did the Llewellin Setter survive FDSB policies and the popularity of the big running trail era that they promoted by them and until the Llewellin Setter's substantial come back in the 1990's. As in the past when foot hunting types of dogs are preferred, the Llewellin Setter is once again the leader and best suited dog for the job.
When I first registered a dog with FDSB, I was astounded by two things. One was the disgraceful use of selling space on registration forms to advertise dog food companies, etc.. everything I received was covered in advertisements. It was my personal opinion that money plaid a major roll in that registry and not the accuracy of paper work or the betterment of the breeds they registered. No wonder FDSB lost most other hunting type breeds of dogs to other registries over the years. In fact, we had always maintained AKC papers on our German Shorthair's and considered FDSB for the big running Field Trial strains and breeds of bird dogs. It's also my understanding that FDSB are charging double what the DNA test actually costs, and have made owner's waste their money on DNA testing dogs when they already know fully well they don't have the parents DNA to compare their dogs with. Interesting enough, they will register the dogs as English Setters without DNA testing. It's my opinion that this proves FDSB true intent to eliminate the Llewellin Setters by requiring DNA only for llewellin Setters and registering them without DNA as English Setters. Seems to me if they are seeking accurate registration, and a dogs parents are truely in question then the dog parents should be checked regardless what breed it is and not just simply register them as English Setters if they are not DNA tested.
The second was as long as I can remember, FDSB NEVER required litter registration of each litter of the dogs they registered. They allow breeders to simply hand write individual puppy forms for each puppy in a litter, adding pups when ever a set of papers were wanted or lost. It seemed to me that without fundamental registration checks and balances like litter registration to record the number of pups born, their sexes, colors, and dates of births of each litter accurately, the door was left wide open for human error, fraud, and corruption to say the least. In fact, any breeder could have basically manufacture false or extra papers at anytime, using FDSB policies. The Lord only knows how many of these self written puppy papers are out floating around and exchanging hands at dog trading events, etc.. All the DNA parenting being done today will not make false pedigrees of generations ago current.
Example: If a Setter was found, purchased, or even stolen without papers, or not of pure breeding, all a breeder would have to do is fill out another puppy paper form a litter they had long ago or could even make up a litter that their dogs never had to come up with a set of papers for them. In fact with the value of pure Llewellin Setters being 2-3 times that of English Setters, what are the odds of someone manufacturing Llewellin Setter papers for the English Setters they also had. In fact it is interesting that some well established English Setter Kennels, suddenly had kennels full of Llewellin Setters and claimed they had them for many, many years. These same dogs can today pass DNA parenting tests, because no one is making them go back several generations when the phenominal happened.
FDSB has now acknowledged having serious problems and in 2002 they started randomly testing DNA parenting and in 2004 made it mandatory on ALL Llewellin Setters, but DNA samples are only as accurate and as honest as the person taking the DNA sample, and the purity of the sample. To my knowledge they still do not require a vet take the DNA or to micro chip, tattoo, or even photos the dog for identification. They are leaving lots of room for fraud, cover up, and even paved a way for someone to frame a reputable breeder who they are jealous of. A DNA sample could easily be contaminated with another dogs DNA resulting in no match with one or both of the dogs recorded parents. I believe this has already happened in an attempt to defame a top Llewellin Breeder.
It is also my opinion that FDSB efforts are way too late and a dollar short. It is my opinion that ethical registries would not be using DNA testing for profit, which is what is happening in FDSB and AKC. We recognized the possibilities of a problem the first time we registered a dog with FDSB in 1996. It can never undo all possible years of paper hanging on the old American Llewellin lines and years of these hand written unrecorded FDSB puppy papers that are still floating around or possibly being manufactured even today. Some being sent in for registration, long after the breeder or the dogs parents have passed away to be verified.
Thi s does not even address that all true hunters know what AKC shows and pet shop puppy mills have done to all the hunting breeds in general and what the FDSB big running field trails have done for the foot hunting bird dogs. It is my personal opinion that FDSB did as much damage to the foot hunting bird dog breeds, resulting in high strung, bull headedness, the need for shock collars, tracking collars, requiring professional training, uncontrollable types of bird dogs, that will never make a natural foot hunting companion house pet.
In fact when I raised German Shorthair Pointers for 8 generations in the 1970's to the 90's we could see first hand how fast the FDSB trails were ruining our breed for the foot hunter and it did not take long for us to see German Shorthair's that looked and acted "just like" English Pointers with docked tails. It is my personal opinion that anyone could see that someone had out-crossed them with English Pointers or even docking some pure English pointer's and registering them as GSHP's. It soon resulted in dedicated GSHP breeder's having to import new trusted stock directly from Germany in an effort to purchase pure, quality, foot hunting type GSHP's, that looked and acted like what a German Shorthair Pointer were suppose to look and act like.
To be honest, I feel the same way about the Dashing Bondhu Llewellin Setter's. While the FDSB breeder's were breeding and crossing the early imports, known as the American lines, the Dashing Bondhu's were being bred in England for over 88 years by Llewellin and Humphrey and even later in Ireland by Fr. Brannon, resulting in these imports being the very last trusted Llewellin Setter bloodlines imported to the US as late as 1988. Also, keep in mind that very few breeder's have kept the last imported Dashing Bondhu's pure so that only leaves a few of the most knowledgeable Llewellin Setter breeder's with them today. We don't own any other breeds or strains of bird dogs, nor do we buy to sell or trade bird dogs, or offer professional training.
International Progressive Breeders' Alliance
(Internationally recognized breeders' alliance and all-breed dog registry)This is why in 1996, we decided to register all our dogs with the International Progressive Dog Breeders' Alliance 'IPDBA'. We did this long before FDSB tried to fix their problems. The reasons were many, but the main reason was that IPDBA has always fully recognized "Llewellin Setters" as a completely separate unique breed of Setter, not just a line of English Setter encouraging breeder's to cross the two breeds. Also, because IPDBA is the only registry designed to improve and address each breeds unique faults and has always required litter registration and a color photo of every dog they register minimal.
They also give the Breed Charter's full control over their breeds future by allowing them to set up each breeds unique registration requirements. That's right, the National Llewellin Setter Association has set up the Llewellin Setter's registering requirements and has full control over their breeds future in IPDBA, not IPDBA. This is why they require three color photo's, a microchip, and a tattoo for identification of each and every Setter IPDBA registers, thus eliminating the possibilities of transferring papers from one Setter to another Setter. DNA parenting is also available at cost, but not mandatory.
IPDBA is also the FIRST and ONLY all-breed dog registry offering "Gun Dog Certification" program. Gun Dog Certification means that the dog has been inspected and Certified to hunt, point, retrieve, and back (honor another pointing dog). It is the best way for everyone who breeds pointing dogs to prove each and every dog they own has the natural instinct and trainability to do what they have been bred to do. Gun Dog Certification separates the puppy mills and profiteers from the serious hunter's who breed to improve and preserve their dogs. All someone needs to do is look at an IPDBA pedigree and they can see for sure that the sire, dam, and maybe even the grand sire, grand dam, etc. of their pup are Gun Dog Certified or not. Each will have "GDC" in front of their name and the dogs complete name will be highlighted in red on their pedigree.
In fact Mountain View Kennel has taken the IPDBA Gun Dog Certification Pledge that Every Llewellin Setter in Mountain View Kennel will be "Gun Dog Certified" before they are used for breeding. There won't be ANY brood females spending their lives stuck in kennels pumping out pups at Mountain View Kennel. All our dogs are members of our family and our personal pleasure foot hunting gun dogs and are hunted regularly.
By the way, it has also been scientifically proven that hunting females during pregnancy produce far better quality and more easily trainable pups. We had always believed this, but now it has been scientifically and chemically proven to be true. Pups out of hunted mothers during pregnancy, have healthier pups and can handle adrenaline better when they are hunted. Hunting our dogs while pregnant is also probably why in over the 38 years we have been breeding hunting dogs, we have never had to have a C-section performed or have lost a female delivering pups and maintain a high percentage of "Natural Hunting Dogs".
Mountain View Kennel was also the first Llewellin Kennel to register it's kennel name with IPDBA. The late OLN's Hank and his son Dash are both IPDBA registered Llewellin Setters. Mountain View Kennel, King's Llewellin Kennel, as well as many other top Llewellin Kennels are all registering their great Llewellin Setters with IPDBA.
In fact IPDBA has quickly become so well respected among Llewellin Setter Breeders, that the NATIONAL LLEWELLIN SETTER ASSOC., the oldest Llewellin Setter organization in the world became the official IPDBA Llewellin Setter Breed Charter and has complete control over the breeds future and registration requirements.
Please note that it is estimated that 99% of all pure Dashing Bondhu Llewellin Setters being produced today around the world are registered with the International Progressive Dog Breeders' Alliance 'IPDBA' and not with FDSB. It is my opinion that it is impossible for any kennel to maintain a large healthy gene pool of pure Dashing Bondhu Llewellin Setter's today without using those registered with IPDBA.
Also, the majority of all other Llewellin Setters of pure bloodline breeding, like of pure Blizzard, pure Roycelle, pure Gladstone, pure Bomber, and pure Tony'O bloodlines, just to name a few are being registered with IPDBA. While the majority of setters being cross bred are still registered with FDSB.
IPDBA recognizes over 500 pure bred dog breeds today making it the largest all breed International dog registry in the world to recognize the "Llewellin Setter" as a unique separate breed and also recognizes the "Russian Llewellin Setter" as unique separate breed of Setter.
To our knowledge, IPDBA is the first and only registry to even offer "Gun Dog Certification" to all their bird dog breeds. Please note, that IPDBA does not mandate registration requirements for any breed. That is left totally up to the IPDBA Breed Charter of each breed. The National Llewellin Setter's Association setups all registration requirements for the Llewellin Setter and Russian Llewellin Setter breeds, not IPDBA and NLSA does not require DNA parenting, OFA or Gun Dog Certification at this time. They have required for several years that all Setter breeds be microchiped, tattooed, and have three color photos of each side and front to be IPDBA registered. This assures the identity of each Setter and makes it nearly impossible to false paper any IPDBA registered Setter. DNA parenting, OFA (Hip) certification remains a owner/breeder option and IPDBA offers to record them right on the dogs registration papers for NO EXTRA FEES! Many Llewellin Kennels are dual registering their Llewellin Setters with IPDBA and FDSB.
IPDBA Fees for Llewellin Setters are as follows:
Transfer from other recognized registries .......................................$15.00
Litter Registration of Registered Dam and Sire ..............................$10.00
Permanent Registration from blue Puppy papers ...........................$10.00
Permanent Registration with 5 generation Certified Pedigree .........$20.00
5 generation Certified Pedigree purchased separately .....................$15.00
Duplicate copies of registration papers ...........................................$ 5.00
Gun Dog Certification inspection fee .............................................$25.00
Life-Time Kennel name registration ...............................................$50.00One time Kennel Specials available for first time transfers. For information contact IPDBA or go to their websites.
IPDBA
PO Box 311
Upton, KY 42784
www.ipdba.8k.comThe National Llewellin Setter's Association may make changes to their breeds registration requirements at any time they feel a change is needed to best preserve, improve, or protect the Llewellin Setter and/or the Russian Llewellin Setter breeds in IPDBA.
When you read in publications and websites claiming a Llewellin Setter is not a breed, they DON'T know what they are talking about. The Llewellin Setter has been recognized as a separate breed since 1902, long before many other breeds have come into existence. Even though there are Setter breeds that allow Llewellin Setters to be out-cross to improve them, the Llewellin Setter NEVER allows any out-crosses what so ever, not to an English Setter or even a Russian Llewellin Setter is allowed.
Our thirty eight years of genetic research and breeding gun dogs tells us that strains should not be crossed with each other. Crossing strains results in a genetic hybrids. They could genetically be the same as crossing two different breeds. Even though some good dogs may be produced in the initial hybrid cross, most will not continue to produce well in the 2nd, 3rd, and future generations once they have been outcrossed. There is no consistency when crossing different strains, because their genetic sequences are different and won't match with any certainty. This is why many breeder's sell crossed pups knowing that the pups they produce are not likely to produce as well for the buyer. That's right, just like with hybrid corn, you can get a good crop on the first planting, but not if you try and plant their seeds and God only knows what recessives are being carried.
At Mountain View Kennel, we offer the same quality and pure Dashing Bondhu bloodlines to everyone regardless who you are and they will produce as good a pups as ours if they are bred to the same standards and quality of pure Dashing Bondhu bloodlines.
NOTICE!
All our Llewellin Setters are permanently identified with registered AVID® microchips,
Tattooed, and are DNA swabbed for
genetic identification.
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All documents, photographs and graphics are Copyright © 1996-2009 Mountain View Kennel. Background photo of Dashing Blaze Bondhu, pure Dashing Bondhu Llewellin Setter dedicated in her loving memory.
